Nevada lawmakers may tackle concealed weapons on college campuses
By Sean Whaley, Nevada News Bureau
CARSON CITY -– A newly elected Republican state lawmaker plans to push forward with a bill next session to allow students and others with permits to carry concealed weapons on the campuses of the Nevada System of Higher Education.
Assemblywoman Michele Fiore, R-Las Vegas, elected to Assembly District 4 in November, has submitted a bill draft request to prepare a measure for consideration in the 2013 legislative session.
The one-line description for the request says: “Authorizes the possession of a concealed firearm on property of the Nevada System of Higher Education under certain circumstances.”
Fiore, a lifetime member of the National Rifle Association, made 2nd Amendment rights a key part of her campaign for the Assembly.
The “campus carry” issue was a controversial topic in the 2011 session, when former state Sen. John Lee, D-North Las Vegas, brought a similar bill to the Legislature. The bill passed the Senate but did not get a vote in the Assembly Judiciary Committee late in the session.
Lee sponsored the bill on behalf of Amanda Collins, a concealed weapons permit holder who was unarmed when she was raped by James Biela in a UNR parking garage in 2007. Collins gave emotional and candid testimony on behalf of the measure at the 2011 session.
Fiore cites the Collins case in requesting the bill, saying in an email there is no reason to prohibit concealed weapons permit holders from being able to protect themselves while on a campus of Nevada’s higher education system.
“In our communities today the bad guys have guns and the good guys obey the law and sometimes because of our firearm laws us good guys are put in a compromising position,” she said. “That is not OK. I will not hesitate to protect myself with my handguns. If I have to make a choice between saving my children’s lives or my own life or letting a scum bag take our lives, I’ll choose to take the culprit out.”
Collins said in her 2011 testimony that she could have defended herself if she had been allowed to carry her weapon on campus.
Biela was sentenced to death in 2010 for the murder of another Reno woman, Brianna Denison, in 2008.
Lee said at a hearing on his bill in 2011 that the decision to make Nevada college campuses “gun-free zones” actually created “defenseless-victim zones.”
CCW permit holders must be at least 21 years of age and take an eight-hour training class.
The Nevada System of Higher Education and several law enforcement groups opposed the measure, however, arguing in part that the discretion to deal with weapons on campus belonged to the Board of Regents, not lawmakers.
Concerns were also cited with how to deal with campus athletic events where alcohol is served, and how to ensure weapons would be safely stored in student dormitories.
With mass murder in class, teachers are told to throw a book at the killer.
We don’t have to be physics majors to know that lead would work much better.
When a person’s sociopathic 1st response to this article, in light of the shootings in Connecticut today, is to promote arming all the school employees and adult students I feel sorry for them. Their priorities as human beings suck.
Mr Fox. You, sir, are an idiot. First you call me a sociopath, then you claim I was promoting arming ALL SCHOOL EMPLOYEES AND ADULT STUDENTS. I did no such thing.
I just happen to think that GOOD PEOPLE should have the ability to fight back against evil ones, one equal footing.
Perhaps you think my priorities suck, but your logic sucks worse.
GUN CONTROL NOW!
Too many of our children are dying because of a high powered vocal minority that pray to the NRA! How you folks sleep at night is far beyond me! And your justifications make me sick!
Dogula: You have a movie version of how things really work. If you armed teachers, (or movie goers in the case of Colorado) the death toll of students and other teachers would most likely have been much higher. Dirty Harry was simply a movie, the average person does not react well to these situations (nor should they be expected to do so) and would fire blindly if at all, resulting in a greater body count.
A simply test is how the average person reacts when their car starts into a 4-wheel drift – most react badly and do nothing or the wrong thing making matters worse. Watch an elite race car driver and yes they can get themselves out of lots of problems, but they represent 1 tenth of 1% of the populations (or less).
More arms will make more and bigger tragedies. While other countries on rare occasion in the western world have endured similar tragedies (e.g., Norway), they occur in this country tens of times more often – we clearly are doing something wrong.
I must admit I am not sure of the best set of solutions – but I do know what will not work – and that is easier access to more guns.
Saddened heart, Rick
In Israel, everyone is armed. Other than islamists attacking them, they do not have these problems.
P.S. Nobody is advocating EASIER access to guns.
Some of us just don’t think that taking them away from those who have NOT committed crimes is the answer.
Screw the gun laws, how about some free help with people who need help regardless of their race,social standing,hey there’s some real nut cases walking the streets ,have no where to seek help.
They closed the mental institutions put them on the streets,it’s not just the homeless people who need help,they come in all walks of life.
A single shooter armed with two hand guns kills 26 people. A single CCW holder with a 5 shot revolver could have stopped this tragedy in its tracks.
I’m as liberal as the next guy, but don’t get caught up in the craziness – there are evil people out there and they can be stopped by good people. Whatever we do, it must facilitate that process.
Dogula: You are correct in Israel (my wife lived there 4 yrs) and Switzerland gun ownership is high. For comparison, in one year 17 people were murdered by guns in Finland, 35 in Australia, 39 in England, 60 in Spain, 200 in Canada and 9,488 in the U.S. Obviously, our obsession with guns is not working and we are less safe because of it. In Israel, the attitude towards guns is nothing like it is hear and Israeli’s who live in this country think we are absolutely bonkers. Interesting, when research looks for correlations with gun deaths in this country, the single most important factor tends to be the level of gun control – greater gun control tends to be correlated with fewer gun deaths. This is not cause and effect and there may be other factors at play, but interesting none the less.
Think about Trayvon Martin. Kid visiting his father in a gated community (read that as kid has a right to be there), interacts with a “local” resident who sees himself as the protector of the community – a scuffle breaks out Zimmerman shoots kid (who has a legal right to be there – remember visiting his father, incident happened at 7:09PM). Now what really happened – may never know, but one thing for sure, if Zimmerman did not have a gun, he probably would not have followed a kid who was there legally, and had not engaged in any illegal activity, and the kid would most likely still be alive. Martin is dead, plain and simple because Zimmerman was carry a gun and felt entitled. That would almost never happen in Israel or Switzerland. But Zimmerman had many conservative champions who believed it was a righteous shooting – it was not.
You want to know the difference – that is the difference. Sadden heart, Rick
Rick, you are the problem. The more that comes out from the Zimmerman case (you know the “light skinned hispanic”) the more you show your ignorance of the facts,of course, MSNBC is your info source. Mr. Sharpton has never let the facts or truth get in his way. Remember Tawana Brauly (sp).
Dogula, you have never been more right on.
Oh yeah Rick, screw the Constitution. Who needs the 2nd amendment or the 1st or the 5th. You get the idea.
Rick, you are the problem. The more that comes out from the Zimmerman case (you know the “light skinned hispanic”) the more you show your ignorance of the facts,of course, MSNBC is your info source. Mr. Sharpton has never let the facts or truth get in his way. Remember Tawana Brauly (sp).
Dogula, you have never been more right on.
Oh yeah Rick, screw the Constitution. Who needs the 2nd amendment or the 1st or the 5th. You get the idea.
You may want to give up your constitutional guarantees for security but I don’t. I prefer freedom and the risks associated with it and hope good men and women feel the same way.
There may be a new ignorant teabagger competitor in the “wrong about everything and proud of it” category here on LTN comments. It won’t be easy to become #1 but you’re off to a good start! There is plenty of common ground to be found on gun safety issues such as background checks and banning some military grade weapons that even a majority of NRA members agree with. Let’s start there and let’s dispense with the “they are coming for your guns” scare tactic BS.
Dear TeaTotal,
Thomas Jefferson said,to paraphrase,
a man with a gun is a free man.
What is your problem with that?
The NRA is a more worthwhile guardian of our constitutional rights than the ACLU, NAACP, La Raza, and Earth Defense Fund.
What say you to that?
Joe Doaks, I do not watch generally watch any cable news channel, except for Comedy Central.
Martin was legally walking in a gated community visiting his father – FACT.
Police have no evidence that Martin was engaged in any illegal activity – FACT
The incident occurred at 7:09PM – a reasonable hour to be out for a kid – FACT
Zimmerman was arrested because the prosecution believe substantial evidence exists to convict him. – FACT
Zimmerman has a reputation as a tough guy (kind of a cop want to be) – FACT
What actually transpired between Zimmerman and Martin is a bit vague as Martin is dead so his side of the story is not easily told – but the police believe enough evidence exist to charge Zimmerman – these facts will come out at the trial.
LET’S BE CLEAR, HAD ZIMMERMAN NOT HAD A GUN, MARTIN WOULD BE ALIVE AND ZIMMERMAN’S LIFE NOT BE ALTERNATED IN A BAD WAY FOR EVER.
The problem is that folks like you believe you are in a Dirty Harry or Die Hard movie. That mentality separates us from the rest of the civilized world and makes us less safe, not more.
If you notice, I never advocated about altering the 2nd amendment. The vast majority of gun control laws have been held up as constitutional, and yes I do support reasonable controls on gun ownership just as I support reasonable restrictions on owning and operating automobiles. It is why my sister and I took my 83 year old mother’s car keys away from her. God help us all if she owned a gun. No one would be safe.
So ask yourself, why does the U.S. have over 10,000 gun murders a year while the rest of the western world barely gets into 3 figures.
US ranks 1st by a long shot in terms of murder rate by guns of countries around the world with an estimated 88.8 guns owned per 100 people. By contrast Israel has 7.3 guns owned per 100 people and ranks 79th in the world of gun murders. There is a very strong correlation of gun ownership and murder rate by guns – not surprising really.
So while I have many friends who own guns, I do not hunt, do not skeet shoot nor target shoot, am not in law enforcement, and clearly do not need a gun to protect myself – so I do not own a gun and do not plan on ever owning a gun. My relatives who hunt, keep their guns locked up because they also do not believe they need a gun to protect themselves. Because the 2nd amendment allows you to own a gun, it does not require it. We need to change our cultural about guns and then we will become safer. Those who do not wish to do so, get use to these situations they will simply keep happening.
Sadly Rick
Rick you can live in your world I will live in mine.
If you want facts then provide all the pertinent ones. Did you forget how NBC edited the tapes to make Zimmerman into a racist? Did you forget the neighborhood had numerous burglaries recently and Zimmerman was doing neighorhood watch? Did you forget the physical injuries Zimmerman had from having his head pounded into the concrete? Did you forget the media called him white? Did you forget how our President stuck his nose into the situation? Did you forget the picture of Mr. Martin,shown ad nauseam on TV, was taken when he was 11 or 12 years old, not 17? Did you forget the Duke lacrosse case?
Maybe the whole truth will come out during Zimmerman’s trial but I doubt it.
The politics of the case are what is really important, isn’t it.
The USA is the richest country ever, agreed? The USA has the most guns in citizens possesion, agreed? Therefore logic says there must be a relationship, agreed?
No guns equals safety. Are you kidding me. Tell that to George Washington. Tell that to the citizens of pre-war Germany or Russia under Putin or China under Chairman Mao.
Maybe you should read Prof. John Lott’s book, “More Guns, Less Crime.” No on second thought, why open your mind to scholarly work that can’t be refuted.
Our founding fathers believed in firearms but what did those mostly old men know?
So you don’t hunt and you don’t eat flesh. Bravo.
And finally if America didn’t have guns you would still be bowing to the the English monarch. Enough.
Excluding those in the military and law enforcement, someone please list everyone who “needs” an automatic assult weapon. Yes I do hunt and have for more years than the average American has been alive
Joe:
This is why Zimmerman may well get convicted. what is relevant in the legal case is not what NBC did or anyone else did, but what probable cause did Zimmerman have to stop and possibly accost Martin.
Zimmerman’s injuries provide no clarity to whether or not Zimmerman had cause. They merely indicate that when a scuffle broke out he got hurt. In other words starting a fight does not mean you will not get hurt – are you that clueless.
The legal case will hinge on did Zimmerman have probable cause to engage in the scuffle in the first place. Martin was there legally and the police find no evidence he was engaged in any illegal activity. NBC reports, Fox Reports, whether we see a picture of Martin when he was 11 or not is not germane or relevant.
It appears that Zimmerman owning and carrying a gun embolden him to the point that he aggressively engaged Martin – a death ensued and Zimmerman’s life whether convicted or not is ruined. Had he not been carrying a gun, Martin would be alive and Zimmerman’s life would not be ruined.
Remember Marin was there legally that is a plain and simple FACT. Zimmerman was your classic busy-body except he was armed and created the problem because he was armed.
John Lott’s thesis is not well documented or well accepted. I can also find people who wrote books that 9/11 was planned by the US Government or Israel or any number of nutcase ideas. What is clearly documented is that their is a strong correlation with increase gun ownership per 100 citizens and increase in gun murder rate. Countries (many of them are democratic societies such as many European Countries) with low gun ownership rank very low in gun murder rate. Admittedly gun ownership is probably not the only explanatory co-variate, but it clearly is the most important.
You conflate many of your arguments and they frankly are illogical. What transpired during the revolution war is not comparable to today’s situation. The 2nd amendment refers to a well regulated militia, which given the citizen armies of yesteryear (remember many soldiers in the early years up to the 1800s in many European countries at the time had to fund their own supplies – a wonderful part of the Three Musketeers was how d’Artagnan, Athos, Porthos, and Aramis acquired their mounts and weaponary to go into battle) that makes perfect sense.
We now seem to have a very different set of circumstances a highly trained and well armed army with weapons not available to civilians (you know rocket launchers, automatic weapons, etc.). The supreme court has interpreted (notice while the conservatives on the court claim to read things literally, they also really interpret to fit their ideology) militia to equate to citizen, but they have upheld restrictions to gun ownership as constitutional. I am pretty sure you can’t legally buy an automatic weapon or rocket launcher, and if you are a convicted felon you are not allowed to own any gun. States have different rules regarding concealed guns. Ask Plaxico Burris about the strict gun laws in NYC (btw constitutional) and whether it is wise to carry a concealed weapon in NYC. Guns in the 1600’s were part of every day life (single shot muskets), you feed your family, and yes in the case of forming a citizen militia they had to self fund forming the army. If Americans reduced gun ownership today, because many decided they simply wanted to, we would find murder rate by guns dropping – not a bad thing where I come from.
You owning a gun in 2012, does not translate into freeing us from government tyranny. Was Zimmerman fighting a big bad government in a locked community, no, he felt tough and accosted a kid LEGALLY WALKING in the neighborhood.
Gun ownership in Russia is 8.8/100, higher than Israel, England and more than twice as high as the Netherlands. Australia gun ownership is 15/100 and has a higher murder rate by guns then Russia. So while Russia is at the lower end of gun ownership per 100, it is now where near the bottom. A number of democratic societies rank lower.
A side note, I said I did not hunt, not that I do not eat flesh. I was simply noting I have not undertaken any hobbies which would require me to buy a gun (my interest lie elsewhere), and as I clearly do not need a gun to protect myself, I cannot think of any good reason for me to buy one. Sadly Rick
I think Zimmerman wanted to be a hero, but made a bad judgement call. Given the choice, I would chose to not have any heroes like that.
There are many upstanding people in our society with no criminal records, that would scare me to death if they had a gun, and were put in the position of having to make a decision in using it. The intelligence level in this country is a scary thing. I admit I wouldn’t even want to be put in that position; which shows I’m at least smart enough to realize that!
Police and military who are trained make mistakes as it is, we don’t need to encourage laymen to take on the role too.
I’m not saying no one should own guns, just scale back everyones fascination with them, get rid of the rapid fire stuff. I realize it’s a complex problem, as guns and violence permeates our culture: video games, movies, and real life use of them to solve problems.
Someday…
Rick, as you say you don’t know all the facts. I figured you ate meat I was just digging you but you couldn’t see that.
Glad you know all about Zimmerman’s psychic. By the way he was there legally also and you don’t know what transpired, so quit making it up. Have you read John Lott’s book or seen him interviewed. If not quit using other peoples opinions. And yes the Brady bunch is for disarming all citizens period. I don’t know where you get your info on gun ownership. Please enlighten me. If private citizens in Russia are allowed to own handguns maybe there may be hope. If you and community don’t want to be around handguns maybe you should think about jolly old England.
No crime there.
Further, why would the founding fathers have a 2nd amendment if not for the individual private citizen? The government can basically do whatever it wants. They have the constitutional power to raise armies so they don’t need a 2nd amendment.
No one is forcing you or anybody else to buy a gun. Does that make you more virtuous being without a rifle or handgun?
Of course you can buy an automatic weapon (one trigger pull will fire many rounds until you release the trigger) if you get a license. You can go to Nevada and pay to fire a machine gun without a license. If you feel like it you can buy a jet fighter, tank, howitzer, just get the necessary permits and licenses.
You are right. I am as illogical as the constitution. So be it.
Joe, please do not be that disingenuous. Zimmerman claims to have been following someone he believed was engaged in suspicious and likely illegal activity, he was told by police to wait. By all accounts he was following Martin not the other way around, he saw himself (as reported by others) as the neighborhood watch guy, he had a gun not Martin and he most likely stopped and question Martin not the other way around. That is why the police have charged him – get a clue.
My friends and family who own guns do so for hobbies and most have rather nice gun safes that they keep their guns locked up in when not engaged in their activity. None of them carry a concealed weapon nor do they keep a firearm for protection. That gun ownership I am quite comfortable with.
My brother-in-law was in law enforcement for over 30 years he is retired, still owns his service revolver and it is locked away and never used. He instead is into archery and I am pretty sure his bows are not loaded, but he does keep the ammunition (arrows) near the bows.
The 2nd Amendment is not being debated here. Whether I like it or not, the Supreme Court has defined what it means, including citizens = regulated militia and that gun control laws are not necessarily inconsistent with the 2nd amendment. There are many legal restrictions to gun ownership that are constitutional and that is how it should be as the founding fathers only owned single-shot muskets and could not have predicted the current technology.
Therefore, the debate is not about the 2nd amendment, but what type of meaningful restrictions and education might reduce gun deaths.
Those that believe they have to own a gun to protect themselves are living in the old west and are part of the problem. Own a gun for hunting, skeet shooting, the biathlon, target shooting, collecting old guns and so on seems fine to me – but when people puff up their chest and see the gun as a solution to their safety, then problems arise. Zimmerman again is the poster child for stupid. Had he not had a gun and simply reported activity he believed (and it apparently was not) to be suspicious, Martin would be alive and Zimmerman’s life would be humming along just fine. It is obvious you can’t accept that as you would have to admit, carry a gun in this case was the root of the problem not a solution.
I suspect you are just being silly, no amount of permits will allow you to buy operational military equipment like jets and howitzer.
Sadly Rick
I would be much more comfortable arming the average school teacher than I am arming the average private security officer.
And for “farkworth,” it’s been a long time since I’ve heard of a shooting involving an automatic weapon, yet California has declared all sorts of non-automatic weapons to be assault weapons –
mostly based on their looks. I’m surprised that, by California reasoning, Nerf guns and water guns haven’t become assault weapons.
Like my hero, Edward Abbey, I’ve been a member of both the NRA and the ACLU; I dropped the NRA because there are too many crazies there, although I support their basic premise – ACLU still gets my membership fees.
My biggest problem with gun control proposals is that most of them come from folks with absolutely no knowledge of firearms.
Again Rick, I would love to know how you got into Zimmerman’s psychic. Maybe you are one of our local psychics. Of course the 2nd amendment is being debated here. You don’t like it, I do. Let’s try to educate because education worked so well for cigerettes and alcohol and drunk driving. You can’t educate people who don’t want to be educated. For example check out how wonderful our K-12 public school system is doing. Especially here in SLT. You want to live in castles in the sky go right ahead.
By the way, every month the NRA publishes numerous incidents where a gun has prevented a serious crime. Dog gone facts. Go ahead and live your life as you want. Stay out of mine.
It’s “psyche” you dolt.
Everyone just shut-up.20 kids are dead and all you want to do is make YOUR point!!
Dog don’t get all bent out of shape, you did say teachers should ‘throw lead’. You did say all but you used the plural, teachers, which could meat all teachers. Then you say you did ‘no such thing’. You did such a thing. Not exactly saying all, but does that really matter? So you are right because there is a difference in mentality behind arming a few teachers, and not all teachers? No, it doesn’t matter. Your criticism based on you not saying ‘all teachers’ is bogus and illogical. You promoted arming more than one teacher. 2 teachers, 10, all, it doesn’t matter, the idea is sociopathic.
And there you go talking about logic again.
And your comment that implies Israel arming teachers and their lack of mass shooting is analogous to the United States is beyond ridiculous. The two countries couldn’t be any more different. For one, Israeli psychos can get just even easier, so long as they shoot anyone other than Israelis.
And Dogula wants us to think someone else has worse logic, she is easily the least logical person who posts here.
Rick, Keep it short.
Yeah Rick. Reading bad, me no like words. Words make head tingle.
I watched the news last night and it made me cry. What a terrible tragedy. All those innocent children and faculty members. The shooter even killed his own mother before he went to the school.
Some form of gun control is long overdue. I’m a gun owner myself but have’nt pulled a trigger in a very long time. I quit hunting, not that the ducks had anything to fear from me, (I’m a lousy shot!).
We talked about gun control here at the house yesterday and there are no easy answers but something must be done.
Pointless wars kiilling thousands of civilians, people being shot in schools, movie theaters or just walking down the street. STOP THE KILLING!
And I cryed…alot. Old Sad Skiis
Joe, read the police accounts and don’t rely on Fox News. We already know that Martin was not engaged in any illegal activity, we know that Zimmerman was the only one with a gun, the police have made it clear Zimmerman was told to wait, we know that Zimmerman engaged Martin (not the other way around), and we know that the police believe amble evidence exist to charge Zimmerman, in a state mind you that has very loose laws. Want to guess who is right on this one Joe?
Restrictions to the 2nd amendment are being debated, not repeal of it, but hey the NRA has never been honest so why start now.
Gun ownership is highly correlated with the gun murder rate in a country. When gun ownership drops, so does the murder rate. Maybe you feel boogymen are hiding under your bed, but I do not live a frightened existence and have never felt that I needed a gun. I am 59 and travel extensively and am quite safe in my manner. Again Zimmerman carrying the gun caused the problem, had he not had a gun, nothing untoward would have happened. Or are you suspending all rational thought and claiming that Zimmerman was minding his own business (which by the way the police have made absolutely clear is not the case). Rick
Rick